Carl Sargeant’s son Jack and widow Bernie arrive for his inquest this morning at Ruthin County Hall in North Wales
A friend of the late Welsh politicain Carl Sargeant has revealed she urged him to ‘stay strong’ after he did not take his sacking ‘particularly well’, as the inquest into his death resumed today.
The Alyn and Deeside AM was found hanged at his home in Connah’s Quay, North Wales, on November 7, 2017.
Four days earlier, the 49-year-old had been sacked from his job as cabinet secretary for communities and children by Carwyn Jones – who also arrived for the hearing in Ruthin today – following claims he had sexually assaulted women.
Today, his colleague AM Ann Jones told the hearing at Ruthin County Hall how she exchanged text messages with him on the evening before his death, but was never asked to do it officially.
Former first minister Mr Jones, who stepped down last December, previously gave evidence about the ‘pastoral care’ of Mr Sargeant after his sacking.
But the coroner’s court today heard from Ms Jones, the Vale of Clwyd AM, who said she had first texted Mr Sargeant upon hearing the news that he had lost his position as a minister during a reshuffle of the Welsh government on November 6.
Mr Sargeant (left) was found hanged at his home four days after he was sacked from his job as cabinet secretary for communities and children by Carwyn Jones (right, pictured today)
She claimed the former advisor of the first minister, Matthew Greenough, had asked her to ‘drop’ Mr Sargeant a message but that she had already set that in motion.
She told the inquest in Ruthin today: ‘I had been at a family funeral and had had my phone switched off all day. When I got home at around 9.45pm I flicked on the news and saw there had been a reshuffle and saw that Carl was no longer in the cabinet.
‘I think I text him saying ‘stay strong, lots of support for you’. Looking back through other messages I saw that I had received a text from Matt Greenough.
‘I can’t remember when I had got that message but he said that he didn’t think Carl had taken it particularly well and asked me to call him over the weekend. But I never felt I’d been given a role to keep an eye on Carl over that weekend.’
Mrs Jones told the coroner that she did not receive any messages back from Carl despite repeated attempts to call him and text him until the evening of November 6 when he thanked his colleague for her support.
At a Labour group meeting on November 7, Mrs Jones said she was asked to sit as chair of the group, to let colleagues know that they could voice their concerns if they ‘felt vulnerable’ or had been subjected to any ‘inappropriate behaviour’.
It was in that meeting that First Minister, Carwyn Jones told Mrs Jones that Mr Sargeant had taken his life, and the meeting was adjourned.
Mrs Jones said: ‘On the Wednesday (November 8) I had driven back from Cardiff and I was in the constituency office when I received a call from Carwyn to say that we were going to have a recalled group meeting for everyone to come together and express their views and show solidarity.
The family of the late politician arrived together for the inquest to resume today in Ruthin
‘He then said there was a level of press interest around how Carl had been taken out of government and he said he was going to tell the press that he had asked me to take a caring role to Carl, and I said don’t do that. That wasn’t my understanding of the texts, and I hadn’t had chance to speak to Carl’s family.’
Ms Jones has faced rigorous questioning over whether former First Minister, Carwyn Jones, ever officially gave her a pastoral care role for Mr Sargeant.
A Mr Thomas, representing the family of Mr Sargeant, including his widow, Bernadette and son, Jack, read from responses given by Mr Jones during questioning by the coroner in November 2018.
When asked if he made contact with Mr Sargeant between the the date of his sacking, November 3 and the date of his death, November 7 2017, Mr Carwyn responded: ‘No, I didn’t think it was appropriate given the fact there was an investigation ongoing but I did check with Ann Jones who was liaising with Carl.
‘I did check how he was doing and I was told that he had his friends and family and I deduced from that he had lots of support on what was a very difficult weekend.’
Mr Thomas went on to add that Mr Jones had said Mrs Jones had seen it as part of her role to provide pastoral care to Mr Sargeant and ‘rightly so’.
Mr Jones told the inquest: ‘Over the course of that weekend and after Carl’s death, she saw it very much as part of her role. It’s not just political, you can’t divorce one from the other.’
But Mrs Jones said she couldn’t recall having a conversation with Mr Jones until the first Labour Group meeting on the Tuesday adding: ‘I wouldn’t have known that he had family or friends with him.’
She said: ‘I think there was a conversation before the start of the meeting held on Tuesday morning (November 7), that’s the only time prior to Carl’s death that we spoke about what had happened over the weekend.’
Mr Thomas added that Mr Jones has since ‘rowed back’ on his initial statements and that he had ‘made a mistake’ and could only recall speaking to Mrs Jones at the Assembly.
The inquest also heard that during another conversation between Mrs Jones and Mr Jones at the recalled Labour group meeting on Thursday (November 9) they discussed whether she should keep the text messages between her and Mr Sargeant from over the weekend.
Mrs Jones said: ‘I said to Mr Jones I think I should keep these text messages – it was more of a rhetorical statement that I wasn’t going to delete them.
She added: ‘I think as time went on certainly my understanding of the ask on the Friday was not the same as his understanding of what the ask was and for my own peace of mind I had to say that it was on an informal basis.
‘Had I have been aware that there was a formal ask of me I wouldn’t have sat back on the Saturday without having had contact from Mr Sargeant at that time.’
The case was adjourned indefinitely last November after it was decided to recall Mr Jones as a witness and allow a legal challenge to be made.
The former first minister had made a legal appeal to allow text messages relating to the behaviour of Mr Sargeant to be heard at the inquest.
At a High Court hearing in Cardiff in May, Mr Jones’s lawyers claimed the failure to hear evidence from the leader and deputy leader of Flintshire County Council, Bernie Attridge and Aaron Shotton – whose texts have been kept from the public, meant the inquest was not a ‘full, fair and fearless investigation’.
But Lord Justice Haddon-Cave said coroner John Gittins acted correctly and ‘well within his scope of discretion’, and the application to have the text messages included was ‘based on speculation as to what that evidence may or may not show’.
Following his death in November 2017, Mr Jones announced an independent inquiry into how he had handled his former minister’s sacking after pressure from Mr Sargeant’s family and Labour politicians.
In March, Mr Sargeant’s widow Bernie won a High Court challenge into the legality of the inquiry after judges ruled it had been ‘unlawful’ for Mr Jones to have been involved in setting up the protocols.
The inquest is expected to conclude later in the week.