Sunrise host Natalie Barr’s very tough question to solider

Sunrise host Natalie Barr has confronted a war veteran after he referred senior Australian Defence Force leaders to the International Criminal Court over alleged war crimes committed in Afghanistan.

Military lawyer and veteran, Glenn Kolomeitz signed the referral alongside Senator Jacqui Lambie.

The referral to The Hague asked the criminal court to examine the country’s high commanders ‘through the lens of command responsibility’.

The pair claim senior commanders have avoided investigation over alleged war crimes in Afghanistan.

On Wednesday morning, Barr asked Mr Kolomeitz whether the country had any right to judge what soldiers did overseas.

‘I’ve got to ask you. This is a question I get asked every time we discuss this general issue,’ she said.

‘We trained these people to kill, and we trained them to operate in a war setting. None of us as civilians have any idea what that’s like and we cannot judge them for when they go over there to war. What do you say to that?’

Mr Kolomeitz stood firm in his view that defence force personnel, regardless of rank, must be investigated if they’ve committed or covered up a criminal act.

‘I worked with these guys on a couple of rotations, and quite frankly, they are amazing advocates for our country, but if they’ve done the wrong thing, they must be properly investigated, and they must be vigorously prosecuted. That’s the reality,’ he said.

‘You can’t ignore the commanders. You vigorously investigate and prosecute those who have done the wrong thing, including those with command responsibility.’

The Sunrise presenter asked whether the chief of the defence force, Angus Campbell, should be investigated as well.

Mr Kolomeitz responded: ‘Every joint task force 633 commander in that job during the period of the enquiry.’

The military lawyer drafted the letter that would be sent to the International Criminal Court.

‘If Australia does nothing about it, the ICC can potentially assume jurisdiction over the higher command and excise the higher command investigation from the ongoing investigation of junior soldiers,’ he said.

The 2020 Brereton report found ‘credible’ evidence that 25 current or former Australian SAS soldiers unlawfully killed 39 Afghan civilians and prisoners between 2005 and 2016.

The report recommended administrative action be taken against ADF personnel where there is credible evidence of misconduct, but not enough for a criminal conviction.

It ruled that senior commanders were not criminally culpable for the alleged crimes.

In an emotional speech yesterday, Senator Lambie – a former ADF member – said leadership had not been held to account for their actions.

Senator Lambie slammed ADF leadership for ‘throwing their diggers under the bus’ in the Senate on Tuesday

‘The government is no doubt hoping this will all just go away,’ she told the Senate on Tuesday.

‘They’re hoping Australians will forget that when alleged war crimes in Afghanistan were investigated, our senior commanders got a free pass while our diggers were thrown under the bus.

‘Well, we don’t forget. I won’t forget. Lest we forget.

‘There is a culture of cover-up at the highest levels of the Australian Defence Force. It is the ultimate boys’ club.’

An Office of the Special Investigator has been set up to address potential criminal matters raised in the Inspector-General of the ADF’s Afghanistan inquiry report, which looked at alleged war crimes committed between 2005 and 2016.

She said the referral was a method of last resort.

‘Quite frankly, I feel embarrassed Australia is in this situation, so I am helping the government today,” Senator Lambie said.

‘I am giving you a second chance to get this right and fix this mess.

‘High command needs to be held responsible.’

She sought to table the referral to The Hague in parliament, but the government, opposition and Greens said they wanted to view the documents before making a decision.